It felt as if it was being shoved down our throats, all that sudden change in Liara is really creepy. Orbrital
- What do you mean by sudden change? Liara has definately evolved as a character, but it has been over the course of the three games and other media. Byrdology
- Well Byrd, I haven't really played ME1, but then in ME2, she was an information broker who was really busy and cannot help (this is completely understandable, saving a friend from the Shadow Broker). I mean, I don't know if she really had any true feelings for Shepard (if you did not romance her), but I know she regarded Shepard as a good friend. But then, that capsule cutscene and that part where she shows Shepard a gift, why couldn't Shepard's LI do it then? Why Liara? That's the thing I am confused about, and also, during that flashback, why did they have to put Liara rather than Shepard's LI? It makes no sense. Orbrital
- And Byrd, I do not hate Liara but I like her as a good friend, but what annoys me so much is that when a game was pushing towards one romance rather than focusing equally on all romance options, it feels so unfair and it is like the game is bashing the crap out of other romances. Orbrital
Considering the fact that she Mind-melds with you regardless of your relationship with her or anyone else...
- So does Shiala... Your point?
Yeah. I totally feel it. Also there's the fact that she almost always appears as the three people Shepard thinks of last as s/he vaporizes/blows up. :P
- Because she has been one of four constant characters throughout the series, not just a background character like say Anderson, but an active squadmate (although only temporary in LotSB). Byrdology
^ There's a mod to fix that if you are on PC. Here's some of the romances: BSN Project Flashback Replacers Miranda is here: Miranda Flashback You get Liara if you romanced anyone but the Virmire survivor, which is just silly if Shepard was a jerk to her in all 3 games. Niquorebel Cousland
- I clicked, got "An error has occurred, you are not permitted to view this page." Yes, riveting imagery Niquo. :P RShepard227
- You need to sign into BSN to be able to view some projects. Do so and try again. I'm sure you'll find it much more riveting. :P Niquorebel Cousland
^ Thanks for that, you give this little girl a moment in which she cries instead of rages at the end... I really hope that EC pulls through now... But enough about that, this is about Liara after all! :P
^ You're welcome. I love when modders make games better. Niquorebel Cousland
I really like Liara as a character but it deffinately seems that way, it's like they wanted to just push out ME2 romance options and only keep the original crew or something, her in particular. It's all kind of ridiculous though, like I said before, 5 minutes with Jack (Of the romance stuff) and almost 40 with Liara? It's kind of ridiculous.
Yes, I really did. Honestly, I felt like Liara got more screen time than any other squadmate. And I really got annoyed with it. Liara got an entier cutacene about Thessia getting destoryed and Tali and Garrus were all like "We have to console her!!!", yet Shepard's really the only one who talk to Garrus about HIS FAMILY being stuck on Palaven! I romanced Tali, not LIara! But Bioware seemed to think that everyone loves her just as much as them! user:Daverwulf
Yes. I completely agree. Liara's great, but I don't need it to be jammed in my cloaca. I wish the nudges were only there if Shepard romanced her in previous games. It wasn't just Liara, either. It also felt like ME3 was trying to push female Shepard to be lesbian. I'm not sure if most players know this, but Kaidan is the only male romance available to FemShep without an import, and that's only if the player chooses that he survived Virmire instead of Ashley. If Kaidan died on Virmire and FemShep had no ME2 romance, she has to be gay or she gets no romance at all. This does not happen to Male Shepard. Male Shepard will always get 4 options, 2-3 opposite sex and 1-2 same sex. FemShep is only guaranteed 3 same sex options: Liara, Allers, and Traynor. What's the choice in that? Do I want blue boobs, white boobs, or brown boobs? They're still boobs. I have no problem with Shepard having whatever sexuality a player chooses, but that's the point, isn't it? Player choice. Niquorebel Cousland
^ Isn't Kaidan picked to survive in no-import runs if Shepard is Female?
^ Only in ME2 is Kaidan automatically chosen without import. In ME3, the player has the option to choose whether Ash or Kaidan survived, but with no foreknowledge that this choice will lock her out of all possibility of heterosexual romance. Regardless of Male Shepard's choice, he will always have at least two opposite sex options and one same sex option. Niquorebel Cousland
Maybe it's because she's the only LI who can't die in the previous two games? Will-O-Wisp
Now I have to defend Liara: Yes, Liara gets the most screen-time. But it is still definetely not the case that she has to much screen-time. It is more the case that the others get too few conversation options (especially Ashley) than Liara has too much. I mean let's face it: She is the freaking Shadow Broker! It is already ridiculous that she in most cases knows just as much as you do. Bioware did the best to avoid the fact that she should know so damn much and already gave her the minimum of screen-time. Albeit it is of course very sad how almost every ME2 romance has been dealt with. Zero7
Thank you, I definitely agree that Liara seems to be pushing as the main love interest. I'd rather have a Shepard canonically have no love interest than a character being pushed as the main love interest. The dialogue with her father and the time capsule if you choose the paragon option is very cringeworthy when you are romancing someone else. Also, why is Liara the last person you are thinking of if you are not romancing Ashley or Kaidan? It would make a lot more sense if it was the person who you are romancing or in Thane's case, him if you didn't romance anyone else after he died. And if you didn't romance anyone at all, Admiral Hackett would have been a much more logical choice since Shepard respects him and sees him as a close friend and someone who looks out for him/her even when he/she was with Cerberus. One last thing that bugs me is that there is no obstacle for the romance with Liara. Hell, even Garrus and Tali would argue with you if you do something they disagree with. Liara is like a Mary Sue (sorry for using that term) in the romance department, she's always with Shepard even if you are an asshole to her, the first game basically had her saying "I love you" in her romance and nothing else. I didn't mind her DLC in Mass Effect 2 since I thought it made up for the shallowness in the first game but in the third game, they made a 180 and turned her into a romance Mary Sue (again, sorry for the term), especially considering the fact that she is literally the only returning party member that can't die, only you talk to Garrus about his family, only you go to Ashley to comfort her regarding her brother in law, only you decide to talk to Tali regarding Legion, only you would have a one on one with Kaidan about the whereabouts of his parents. Everyone pretty much says "Oh, Liara is sad, lets cheer her up," after what happens on Thessia.
^ You just published ever point I was going to point out, kudos. The game seems to push Liara harder for a romance and on the other hand, completey dropped the ball with Diana Allers(She was attractive but had no depth in her character, the worst choice in the game) In the first Mass Effect you pretty much had no choice. You either had to pick Ashley or had to pick Liara and If you didn't pick Ashley/Kaiden you automatically get Liara anyway
Oh joy, more Liara-hating nonsense.
^ Hey, Anon, did you read anything on this page? None of it is Liara hate. Most posters mention the fact that they like her character. It is, in fact, players discussing how they felt the game was steering Shepard toward a Liara romance. In a game that claims to give characters freedom of choice, nudging toward one choice over others can be irritating for players who wish to make another choice, and in some cases, already have made another choice. Niquorebel Cousland
I'm not sure I disagree with anything anyone has said, though I do feel like Bioware is at least attempting to not push Liara on the player through Feron. Of course, Feron doesn't make a physical appearance in Mass Effect 3 and Liara explicitly states that she isn't with him at the end of Lair of the Shadow Broker, but I wanted to point out that Bioware seems to have at least recognized that not everyone feels the same connection with Liara that she feels with Shepard.
I wouldn't say so. I mean, there's certainly a lot of emphasis on the Shepard/Liara relationship (be it a romance or a friendship) in ME3, but then the same can be said for Shepard's relationship with Garrus (you can tell the devs have a lot of love for these two squadmates, perhaps more so than for any others).
I also found out the other day that you can actually get locked out of a romance with Liara if you take an overly Renegade tone with her throughout ME3, and I think the only love interests that happens with aside from her are Kaidan and Ashley.
I think it is partly because of the fact that Liara cannot be killed in the previous two games, whereas most other teammates can be lost lost on the suicide mission (and Virmire.) In my opinion, I think that is also why the screentime for some other characters is a bit wonky. The developers were probably able to put a lot more time into the characters with a guaranteed appearance than those without. Not saying I agree with that decision, but it is food for thought.
- It's a flashback, Why does the character has to be alive???
I got the feeling that Liara was pushed to be the canon/default LI since ME1. 1st of all there was this one "bug!" where you got locked on her w/o even knowing (I was surprised she's the one coming to me after Virmire!), She's the only one who keeps searching for Shepard even after his death, She the only one who's available for romance in all 3 games and for both genders, she's the only squadmate who's not kill-able by normal means, and together w/ Garrus they are the only ones who never really argue with Shepard or disagree with him no matter what s/he does. Bad Dreamer
I think having Liara be the one to search for Shepard's body was mostly born out of necessity. Consider: the person who searched for Shepard's body couldn't have been Ashley or Kaidan, because they can both die over the course of ME1, so using either one of them risks contradicting the canon of people who saved the other. It couldn't have been Wrex, for the same reasons as above. It couldn't have been Garrus because his recruitment is optional, so again you have a case of potential contradiction of canon. That would leave Tali, but I imagine having her be the one who rescues Shepard would only stir up an outcry along the lines of, "Why is Tali searching for me but not my love interest?! Doesn't he/she care about me?". Having Liara be the one resolves a lot of these problems. She can't die, her recruitment isn't optional and she's a potential love interest (and a fairly popular one at that). Having her search for Shepard's body avoids the potential contradiction of canon and it satisfies the notion of having Shepard's love interest look for them.
- TIM/Miranda could have found Shepard by themselves, Liara's assistance wasn't necessary. The fact remains that she'll look for Shepard even he was a jerk to her in every single conversation in ME1, and this easily pushes her to a "canon LI" status as you're "not supposed" to be jerk to her. Bad Dreamer
- Sure, but the story where Shepard's body is found was sold as a comic book tie-in to the videogames, and that will inevitably draw more attention, sell better and have more of an impact - on both audiences and the story - if you advertise it with the fact that it actually stars one of the characters from the first game (and, again, one of the popular characters at that) instead of a bunch of characters you don't know.
- Plus, having no familiar characters from ME1 looking for Shepard just loops back into the "why don't my squadmates/love interests/friends/whatever care about me" thing.
- We can agree to disagree on the advertising part (I believe "Redemption" was released after ME2, TIM & Miranda are both established characters at the time. Besides all other novels/comics were made without the games squadmates as leads). But in any case, that doesn't change the fact that Liara is always the one always following Shepard no matter what. There is no way to get her killed, no way to lose her loyalty, no way to kick her off the team, And she's the only one with romance sequence in all 3 games. And the fact that she's the only one going after Shepard's body after his death is only the topping to the cake. And btw; having Liara going after your body even though you never really gave her any attention in ME1 is laso a source of rage for Liara haters, which brings us back again to the fact that you're not supposed to be mean to her (in other words: she's made to be special). Bad Dreamer
I actually romanced Liara with one of my Shepard's but I agree with this completely. With my non Liara romance Shepard I was literally wondering if I accidentally imported the file with her as my romance for awhile, the game pushes you towards the choice without a doubt. However I find that all the romance side stories were complete garbage, nowhere near what they could have been, or what loyal Shepard's were promised. Your love interests just don't really seem to care about Shepard at all or nowhere near as much as Shepard cares about them, the best romances I've seen are Tali and Garrus, they actually care about the stress Shepard is under, but outside of their character interactions their romances were completely bombed just like everyone else's.
Liara is the one person who is singularly dedicated to Shepard. Her entire personality has changed to gravitate around him/her. She is the one who made it possible to bring Shep back from the dead, and she became the Shadow Broker (which is a little far removed from being and archeologist) in order to help Shepard on his/her mission. She has essintially rededicated her life to support Shepard in any way she can. Plus the fact that she can be a LI for either m/f makes her a unique character from the beginning. I think it is safe to assume that wether you romance her or not, she will always be in love with Shepard. I don't think that she was intended to come on so strong as a LI, but the way her character has evolved, it is kinda hard to get the strong emotions that she feels toward Shepard pulled off without it seeming that they intend for you to romance her. Byrdology
Yes, I concur Topic Creator. In fact, it unintentionally made her seem a bit creepy to me. For example, I had romanced Miranda, and yet straight after she mind-melded with my Shep in London, she very 'suggestively' stroked down Shep's arms in a seductive manner. A result of lazy programming no doubt (didn't want to/have time to cater a supposedly "subtle" moment to every player's experience). And yes, seeing Liara in the flashback at the end regardless of personal choices in terms of Shep's relationships was a true 'wtf moment', but I was already completely detached from the game by that point, so in real terms, I cared little, lol. In principle though, it was another notch of poor quality control evident in the ending. In regards to Liara herself, I've never particularly felt strongly about her character one way or another. She was bland in ME1. However, from ME2 onwards, I felt loyal to her, you know, cos she saved Shep from the Collectors, and I guess I respect her in general for her skills, her loyalty, and sticking steadfastly to her principles etc, but I never developed an emotional attachment to her. 220.127.116.11 17:32, May 21, 2012 (UTC)
In ME1 Liara is more straightford about her feelings for Shepard than either Ashely or Kaiden. I think that the in-game situation with Liara is either she's Shepard's "one true love" or she has unrequited feelings for her/him throughout the entire series, even if he/she romanced someone else.
As for Liara being loyal to Shepard even if he's mean to her? I figured that was also a result of her love for Shepard, requited or not. She is less confrontational in general than any of the other LIs. In ME1 if Ashely/Kaiden and Liara are romanced at the same time, they will confront Shepard and ask him/her to choose. Shepard can get greedy and suggest a threesome, which disgusts Ashely/Kaiden, but not Liara. That could be interpeted as Liara herself not being opposed to the idea, but it has more to do with Liara's accepting nature. Also, Liara has no prior relationships (as stated in ME1), so Shepard is her first love. The first cut is the deepest /sappy tune.
However, Shepards other LI should have been devolped as well as her, and it would've been nice if the ME2 romances could have carried over to ME3. Also, can't Tali or Garrus also be romanced in ME3 if a romance with them was started in ME2? I've yet to import a save where my Shepard romanced one of them. If those relationships can't be continued in ME3 than that is just bull. With the other ME2 romances, at least the characters aren't part of the squad anymore. Tali and Garrus are, so there's no excuse for cutting off a possible romance with them. The Illusive Shepard 04:31, May 22, 2012 (UTC)
- All good points, but that last line was the clencher! I remember in DA everyone got a fair shake as far as LI plot lines (with the exception of maybe Morrigan for obvious reasons). Even during party banter which is one thing that I wished we could have seen more of... It took me hours to go through every possible combination and conversation thread in DA. And I loved how the party reacted to the LI even after they broke up. The one thing that I think they did right in ME3 was have Tali and Garrus hook up. Byrdology
^ Yep, you can continue a romance with Tali or Garrus. Can't start one if you didn't romance them in ME2 though. I quite liked the expansion of Tali's romance, given how late you get her as a squadmate there was a reasonable amount of stuff. Question0